Categories
Antarctica Interviews

Interview with Mauri Pelto, glaciologist

Bluesky is becoming a home away from the HellSite for scientists. I recently “met” Mauri Pelto, whose bio describes himself thus –

Glaciologist who has spent 40+ years doing fieldwork on glaciers. Science advisor to NASA Earth. US Representative to the World Glacier Monitoring Service. Author of blog “From a Glaciers Perspective”. Grandparent, avid skier, dog walk/runner.

His googlescholar profile is here.

He kindly agreed to an email interview, and here it is.

  1. A little bit about you – who you are, where you were educated, “why glaciology”? I began working on glaciers in Alaska during the summer of 1981. The initial goal as to cross country ski in the summer to help me qualify for the US Ski Team. This worked, but I chose grad school instead in 1984 enrolling at the University of Maine. I designed the North Cascade Glacier Climate Project as a 50 year field project to monitor glaciers across the range. This was in response to a high priority of the National Academy of Sciences in 1983. At the time the USGS monitored a single glacier in several different ranges, and with the Reagan budget cuts was not going to be able to expand. The glaciers are all in Wilderness areas precluding the use of mechanized equipment and requiring backpacking to access. I chose not to seek federal funding and have financed the project with consulting work.

2. How and when you first heard about the issue of carbon dioxide build-up (presumably in your undergraduate degree?)

Terry Hughes was my advisor, he was very knowledgeable about ice sheets, while all my experience and insights were on alpine glaciers. I had a chance to work on Pine Island and Thwaites Glacier projects in 1985 and Jakobshavn Glacier in 1986. We , the glaciologic community understood these locations were key places where profound change was going to happen and set up projects to begin monitoring.

 In ice cave under Sholes Glacier

3. John Mercer wrote a famous (well, it’s all relative) paper for Nature, in January 1978 – do you recall reading it? Had you met him by then? Any recollections? I met John Mercer before meeting Terry Hughes. He had worked in Patagonia and Alaska areas I was more experienced with. I sought his guidance along with William O. Field about where to set up a project. He was not overly helpful.

4. Terry Hughes wrote a paper in 1980 about the “soft underbelly of the West AIS” – again, how did you know Terry, any recollections? I worked with Terry for four-years the first year working most of the time in his office with him. I finished my Masters and then PhD as quickly as possible in 1989. He was a brilliant, iconoclastic person.

On Mount Baker with my daughter Jill who co-directs the project with me now

5. How, from your perspective, has glaciology changed as a discipline over the years you’ve been involved (e.g. fleshing out the bsky comment)

I had a chance to address the glaciology community at the 100th anniversary AGU meeting in Washington DC in 2019. I pointed out that thirty five years prior all the glaciologists in the world could have fit in this room, that now held only as many people ~300 as worked on just the Helheim Glacier for example. This rapid increase in number of glaciologists was due unfortunately to the dire necessity that climate change posed for the cryosphere. That we need everyone of you to focus on what you do well and monitor, observe, develop and model that. That this generation of scientists was embracing collaboration instead of competition. This is why I have for 20 years incorporated artists in our research expeditions. Note below. I continue to work in the field every summer and with NASA on projects like the one published today.

https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/154764/alaskas-brand-new-island https://www.cbsnews.com/video/capturing-the-melting-of-glaciers-with-data-and-art/

    Categories
    Cultural responses United States of America

    September 15,1990 – Captain Planet launches

    Thirty five years ago, on this day, September 15th, 1990, 

    The first episode of “Captain Planet and the Planeteers” was broadcast.

    Captain Planet and the Planeteers, commonly referred to as simply Captain Planet, is an American animated environmentalist superhero television series created by Barbara Pyle and Ted Turner[1] and developed by Pyle, Nicholas Boxer, Thom Beers, Andy Heyward, Robby London, Bob Forward, and Cassandra Schafausen. The series was produced by Turner Program Services and DIC Enterprises and broadcast on TBS and in syndication from September 15, 1990, to December 5, 1992

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 354ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was we’ve got to propagandise the young about how The System cares and can be fixed to solve whatever the problem seems to be. There are vast indoctrination efforts going on, all the time.

    The specific context was that Ted Turner was then married to Jane Fonda, who switched him on to environmental issues. 

    What I think we can learn from this is that the efforts at getting the kids riled up? Yeah, doesn’t last.

    What happened next

    There is a seriously hilarious spoof with Don Cheadle.

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    References

    King, D. L. (1994). Captain Planet and the Planeteers: Kids, environmental crisis, and competing narratives of the new world order. Sociological Quarterly, 35(1), 103-120.

    Also on this day: 

    September 15, 1948 – Biologist Evelyn Hutchinson mentions carbon dioxide build-up at an AAAS symposium.

    September 15, 1980 – Australian scientists hold “Carbon Dioxide and Climate” symposium in Canberra

    September 15, 1982/1990 – “Environmental Justice” is born. And so is Captain Planet…

    September 15, 1996 – A CCS posterchild is born: Sleipner Field comes online. – All Our Yesterdays

    September 15, 2008- business splits over what to extort from Rudd…

    Categories
    United Kingdom

    September 15, 1830 – Manchester-Liverpool railway opened

    One hundred and ninety five years ago, on this day, September 15th, 1830, 

    The Liverpool and Manchester Railway[1][2][3] (L&MR) was the first inter-city railway in the world.[4][i] It opened on 15 September 1830 between the Lancashire towns of Liverpool and Manchester in England.[4] It was also the first railway to rely exclusively on locomotives driven by steam power, with no horse-drawn traffic permitted at any time; the first to be entirely double track throughout its length; the first to have a true signalling system; the first to be fully timetabled; and the first to carry mail.

    Liverpool and Manchester Railway – Wikipedia

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 284ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that poor bloody horses had been pulling wagons of coal along tracks for a while. Then someone had the bright idea of getting steam engines to do the work…

    The specific context was an MP got himself killed.

    What I think we can learn from this Is that we are a very inventive bunch of murder apes.

    What happened nextRailway mania”. And almost 200 years later, the English can’t even build a railway between London and Manchester. But we’re definitely going to build a huge CCS infrastructure. Sure we are.

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 15, 1948 – Biologist Evelyn Hutchinson mentions carbon dioxide build-up at an AAAS symposium.

    September 15, 1980 – Australian scientists hold “Carbon Dioxide and Climate” symposium in Canberra

    September 15, 1982/1990 – “Environmental Justice” is born. And so is Captain Planet…

    September 15, 1996 – A CCS posterchild is born: Sleipner Field comes online. – All Our Yesterdays

    September 15, 2008- business splits over what to extort from Rudd…

    Categories
    Australia South Paciific

    September 15, 2005 – “A Citizen’s Guide to Climate Refugees launched by FOE Australia”

    Twenty years ago, on this day, September 15th, 2005,

    Friends of the Earth Australia: A Citizen’s Guide to Climate Refugees – “While the Earth has always endured natural climate change variability, we are now facing the possibility of irreversible climate change in the near future. The increase of greenhouse gases in the Earth’s atmosphere from industrial processes has enhanced the natural greenhouse effect.”

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 380ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was the issue of climate refugees rocking up in Australia was not new – James Burke had talked about it in his 1989 documentary “After the Warming.”

    The specific context was that Friends of the Earth battles on, trying to get people to think about the uncomfortable issues.  2005 was before the ‘great awakening of late 2006-2007’ and it must have seemed pretty futile, but they persisted.

    What I think we can learn from this: You have to keep saying the truth.  Hardly anyone listens, but wasn’t it ever thus?

    What happened next

    Anthony Albanaese started wanging on about climate refugees in late 2006, as a way of cornering John Howard  (see my October last year stuff).

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    References

    Xxx

    Also on this day: 

    September 15, 1948 – Biologist Evelyn Hutchinson mentions carbon dioxide build-up at an AAAS symposium.

    September 15, 1980 – Australian scientists hold “Carbon Dioxide and Climate” symposium in Canberra

    September 15, 1982/1990 – “Environmental Justice” is born. And so is Captain Planet…

    September 15, 1996 – A CCS posterchild is born: Sleipner Field comes online. – All Our Yesterdays

    September 15, 2008- business splits over what to extort from Rudd…

    Categories
    Australia

    September 14, 1991 – the Green Wave has receded….

    Thirty four years ago, on this day, September 14th, 1991,

    “In an article in the Good Weekend of September 14, Deirdre Macken produced much evidence from market research that public concern about the environment, and the public’s willingness to buy eco-friendly products, had subsided markedly since their surge in 1989.”

    Ross Gittins

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 356ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that the first wave of global eco-concern (1969 to 1972 or so) had given us UNEP and also the “issue-attention cycle”.

    The specific context was that we were near/at the end of the public interest in/concern about the greenhouse effect etc. The media was covering it less – no new angles to be had.  These things then enter a kind of death-spiral.   

    What I think we can learn from this – creating organisations that can cope with this death-spiral, this “abeyance” is really tough. They become bureaucratic, soulless grant-grubbers, or they wink out of existence. There oughta be a third way…

    What happened next

    “The climate” did not burst back onto the scene in a big way until the end of 2006.  And then followed the pattern – by 2010 everyone was exhausted. But the 2010 election, and Prime Minister Gillard’s reliance on Independents and Greens, kept the policy window open…

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 14, 1993 – scientists suffer backlash (not outa thin air though)

    September 14, 1994 – Business told to brace for climate regulation/tax (which it then handily defeats) – All Our Yesterdays

    September 14, 2004 – Blair “shocked” by scientists warnings – “time is running out for tackling climate change”

    Categories
    United States of America

    September 13, 1856 – the game’s a Foote

    One hundred and sixty nine years ago, on this day, September 13th, 1856,

    Her article sparked interest and praise, notably in the 13 September issue of Scientific American magazine, in an article titled ‘Scientific ladies – experiments with condensed gases’: ‘Some have not only entertained, but expressed the mean idea, that women do not possess the strength of mind necessary for scientific investigation […] the experiments of Mrs Foote afford abundant evidence of the ability of woman to investigate any subject with originality and precision.’ https://www.chemistryworld.com/culture/eunice-foote-the-mother-of-climate-change/4011315.article#/

    And

    Scientific American 1856: Scientific Ladies - Experiments with Condensed Gases. | Hill Heat

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 285ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that the 19th century was kinda exciting for “science” (new word, only just taking over from “natural philosophy”).

    The specific context was Eunice Foote was a campaigner for women’s suffrage, and a scientist.  

    What I think we can learn from this – we could have done better as a species, but, well, here we are…

    What happened next

    Foote’s work specifically on climate was forgotten, but then rediscovered by retired petroleum geologist Ray Sorenson. In January 2011, in the American Association of Petroleum Geologists‘ on-line journal Search and Discovery he had this article.-: “Eunice Foote’s Pioneering Research On CO2 And Climate Warming

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 13, 1661 – Fumifugium! – All Our Yesterdays

    September 13, 1976 – US news broadcast on ozone and climate.

    September 13, 1984 – unsettling Seattle workshop on sea level rise – All Our Yesterdays

    September 13, 1992/1994- Scientists traduced, ignored

    Categories
    Renewable energy United Nations

    September 12, 2023 – Gone with the wind

    Two years ago, on this day, September 12th, 2023,

    “No bids were received by offshore wind developers due to what companies said were unrealistically low prices.

    Afterwards, wind farm manufacturers said they held positive discussions with Claire Coutinho, the new Energy Security Secretary, but were left bewildered days later by a meeting with Graham Stuart, the Net Zero Minister, who appeared to play down the auction results.

    His comments during a meeting on Tuesday [12 September 2023] left some attendees unsure whether the Government was committed to addressing the issues in next year’s auction, multiple sources said. 

    Oliver, M. 2023. “Industry on hold after auction flop spooks developers. Sunday Telegraph, September 17”

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QLlam1rJWJ76VZ66kfh81SwlRhxeZwnO8BuxaJj7CxA/edit?usp=sharing

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 376ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it is 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that offshore wind was the accidental success story of UK renewable energy policy.  There was a de facto ban on on-shore wind, thanks to the government of David “cut the green crap” Cameron, so offshore began to look attractive….

    The specific context was that by this time two years ago (god it feels like forever) the Sunak government had decided that pissing on the environment might be a vote winner.

    What I think we can learn from this is that we are stumbling into some very nasty situations. With our eyes open. Oh well.

    What happened next

    There’s another auction – with results due in December or so (everything’s delayed at present).

    UK to Launch Seventh CfD Auction in August, Offshore Wind Has Its Own AR7 Timeline | Offshore Wind

    Here’s Reform’s Richard Tice on the latest auction

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 12, 1958 – Letter in The Times about … carbon dioxide build-up

    September 12, 1994 – Greenpeace lays into Keating government over climate failure – All Our Yesterdays

     September 12, 2003 – Newcastle Herald thinks the future of coal looks ‘cleaner’…

    Categories
    Australia South Paciific

    September 11, 2015 – Pacific Island leaders fail to shift Australia and New Zealand…

    Ten years ago, on this day, September 11th, 2015,

    AAP, 2015. Pacific island leaders fail to shift Australia and NZ on climate targets. The Guardian, 11 September

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/11/pacific-island-leaders-fail-to-shift-australia-and-nz-on-climate-target

    Pacific islands nations failed to convince Australia and New Zealand to back stronger targets on limiting global warming as the showdown at the Pacific Islands Forum on Thursday ended in a stalemate.

    The 16 leaders at the forum agreed to disagree on whether to take a two degree or 1.5 degree warming limit stance to UN talks in Paris in December.

    Small island nations facing rising seas pushed hard for the 1.5 degree target, saying anything higher risked their survival.

    Pacific Islands Forum meeting in Port Moresby ends with leaders agreeing to disagree over whether to take 1.5 or two degree target to Paris climate talks

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 401ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it was 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that the UNFCCC was stuffed from the start. The George H.W. Bush administration resisted all efforts to get targets and timetables for rich nations to reduce their emissions into the text of the treaty.  Eventually, the French, who’d proposed it, raised the white flag.  So we got a meaningless but nice sounding treaty with “common but differentiated responsibilities.” Everything since then can be seen as an attempt to heal that early wound.  No success.

    The specific context was that Paris was coming and Australia’s government was made up of climate deniers like Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull. God help us.

    What I think we can learn from this is that the governments of rich countries are perfectly happy with everyone else – and this is especially the case of brown people – basically dying. A few will be “let in”, for show, but the rest? They can burn or fry.

    What happened next

    Paris was a farce.

    The 1.5 promise was made, but no action to meet it was ever taken. Now, well, 1.5 is toast and we are not going to avoid 2 or 2.5 or probably even 3.  This, people, is why I didn’t breed. I could see this sort of shit coming in the 1990s. And here we are. 

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 11, 1961 – New York Times reports “Air Found Gaining in Carbon Dioxide”

    September 11, 1973 – CIA coup topples Chilean democracy

    September 11, 1989 – Bill McKibben’s “The End of Nature” published – All Our Yesterdays

    September 11, 2006 – Australian climate concern hits tipping point (maybe) –

    Categories
    United States of America

    September 11, 1969 – George Brown proposes an omnibus environment bill

    Fifty six years ago, on this day, September 11th, 1969, Californian Congressman George Brown introduced an “omnibus” environment bill.

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 324ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it was 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that through the second half of the 1960s various Congressmen (mostly but by no means entirely Democrats) had introduced various bills about pollution (air, water etc).  Most of this had been performative.

    The specific context was that by mid-1969 the “environment”/ecology was competing with the assault on Vietnam for people’s attention (anti-war activists were understandably suspicious, obvs).

    What I think we can learn from this is that politicians have antennae, and will try to amplify the things they want amplified. (Not ALL of them are corporate meat-puppets, at least, not all of the time).

    What happened next – the times were propitious, and President Nixon signed the NEPA into law in January 1970.  Various bodies were formed, reports written and released, speeches given.  Guess what – the emissions kept climbing. 

    To be fair to George Brown, he was behind the successful push for a National Climate Act, that President Carter signed in 1978.

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 11, 1961 – New York Times reports “Air Found Gaining in Carbon Dioxide”

    September 11, 1973 – CIA coup topples Chilean democracy

    September 11, 1989 – Bill McKibben’s “The End of Nature” published – All Our Yesterdays

    September 11, 2006 – Australian climate concern hits tipping point (maybe) – All Our Yesterdays

    Categories
    Carbon Capture and Storage United Kingdom

    September 10, 2015 – one of those “whither CCS?” articles

    Ten years ago, on this day, September 10th, 2015, the Financial Times did one of its “Big Reads.”

    More than $30bn has been committed, or spent, on carbon capture and storage schemes to deal with CO2 emissions curb climate change but so far the sector – the preferred option of the fossil fuels industry – has fallen short of expectations. By Pilita Clark

    Today it is just a scrubby field next to the enormous Drax coal and wood pellet power station in the English county of North Yorkshire. But in a matter of months, this could be the spot where the UK finally gives the go-ahead for what has become one of the world’s most perplexing tools in the quest to combat climate change : a carbon capture and storage plant.

    Clark, P. 2015. Miracle machine or white elephant? FT BIG READ: CLIMATE CHANGE. Financial Times, 10 September, p.11.

    The amount of carbon dioxide in the air was 401ppm. As of 2025, when this post was published, it was 430ppm. This matters because the more carbon dioxide in the air, the more heat gets trapped. The more heat, the more extreme weather events. You can make it more complicated than that if you want, but really, it’s not. Fwiw, I have a tattoo of the Keeling Curve on my left forearm.

    The broader context was that the much hyped Paris COP was only two months away, and the full-page adverts of greenwash were starting to appear in the pink’un (aka the Financial Times). So, time to let one of the hacks (quite a good one, imo) educate the rich.

    The specific context was that it was also hot times for CCS policy – a second competition (the first had fizzled out)) was picking up speed.

    What I think we can learn from this  is that we’ve been talking about turning points and last chances for a very very long time.

    What happened next

    The second competition for CCS was very abruptly cancelled (people were seriously butt-hurt, understandably).

    Paris was a joke, but one we still, apparently, have to take seriously.

    And Drax?  Well, there’s an FCA investigation about its “sustainability” claims just firing up…

    What do you think? Does this pass the ‘so what?’ threshold? Have I got facts wrong? Interpretation wrong? Please do comment on this post, unless you are a denialist, obvs.

    Also on this day: 

    September 10, 1957 – The Times covers the International Geodesy Conference… – All Our Yesterdays

    September 10, 1973- Ozone concerns on display in Kyoto…

    September 10, 2007 – shiny #climate promises versus grim reality

    September 10, 2008 – Greenpeace Kingsnorth protesters acquitted